Comments on: Feminism And Biblical Roles http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/ reb•e•lu•tion (reb’el lu shen) n. a teenage rebellion against the low expectations of an ungodly culture. Fri, 21 Nov 2008 09:43:52 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.3 by: Kara Fuller http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-287208 Sat, 02 Aug 2008 04:53:16 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-287208 I dont feel that the "core feminist theory" is to "abolish distinctions between man and woman." I mean, yes, when applying for a job, internship, loan, leadership position, or for a college, male or female should not make a difference. A woman should make the same salary as a man in the same job with the same credentials. Sadly, in many cases, women do not earn the same wages. Women should not be barred from certain occupations, and men shouldn't either. So in a sense, I guess you are right, as a feminist i believe that there should not be distinctions between man and women when it comes to the work force as well as social issues. I belive that the main point of Feminism, at least, how I see it, is to end discrimination against women. Just as there should not be discrimination against people of minority races, ther should not be discrimination against women. "The Bible predicts that if the feminist movement reaches equality, it will not stop there. Instead, woman will replace men as the dominators—and perhaps that is their true goal." Do you really believe that if a woman is treated equally, she will try to dominate you? I really dont understand where this argument comes from. In fact, you specifically say "replace men as the dominators" Why are men the dominators in the first place. Why can't men and women work together equally, instead of one dominating the other? Are you afraid of woman leaders? We could have had a woman president. Is that an example of feminists trying to dominate men? You say that to avoid having women "replacing men as dominators" they must not reach equality. I thought you said that women and men were created equally in Gods image. With respect, you are conradicting yourself here. If man and woman are equally in Gods image, then should they not also be treated equally. You do not believe that women should reach social equality, even though you believe that they are equal in gods mind. Please correct me if im wrong, this is just how i interpreted your essay. You say that women and men should have seperate roles. You didnt say what those roles are. What type of roles were you reffering to? Were they career related roles? Please tell me that you arent saying the role is to stay at home. Please tell me that you arent saying women should have leadership roles. Women are just as equally qualified for any position as men. If a woman decides to be president, and is fairly elected, then she is equally qualified. If she decides to be a doctor, she is just as qualified as a man. If she decides to become a teacher, an engineer, a lawyer, an astronaut a construction worker, or a stay at home parent, she is just as equally qualified for the job as a man. A woman should be allowed to make her own choices for her life and career and shouldnt be forces to stay within certain roles. Just as a man should not either. If a man wants to be a stay at home dad, why can't he? Your argument of equality bith with distinct roles reminded me automatically of "seperate but equal." In Brown v. Board of Education, the supreme court declared that seperate can never be equal. Just as it was unfair to discriminate against blacks, it is unfair to discriminate against whites. Feminists simply want equal rights for men and women, and there is nothing biblically wrong with equality. I hope my argument isn't disrespectful, I respect you for your beliefs, i simply wanted to state mine. I dont feel that the “core feminist theory” is to “abolish distinctions between man and woman.” I mean, yes, when applying for a job, internship, loan, leadership position, or for a college, male or female should not make a difference. A woman should make the same salary as a man in the same job with the same credentials. Sadly, in many cases, women do not earn the same wages. Women should not be barred from certain occupations, and men shouldn’t either. So in a sense, I guess you are right, as a feminist i believe that there should not be distinctions between man and women when it comes to the work force as well as social issues. I belive that the main point of Feminism, at least, how I see it, is to end discrimination against women. Just as there should not be discrimination against people of minority races, ther should not be discrimination against women.
“The Bible predicts that if the feminist movement reaches equality, it will not stop there. Instead, woman will replace men as the dominators—and perhaps that is their true goal.” Do you really believe that if a woman is treated equally, she will try to dominate you? I really dont understand where this argument comes from. In fact, you specifically say “replace men as the dominators” Why are men the dominators in the first place. Why can’t men and women work together equally, instead of one dominating the other?
Are you afraid of woman leaders? We could have had a woman president. Is that an example of feminists trying to dominate men? You say that to avoid having women “replacing men as dominators” they must not reach equality. I thought you said that women and men were created equally in Gods image. With respect, you are conradicting yourself here. If man and woman are equally in Gods image, then should they not also be treated equally. You do not believe that women should reach social equality, even though you believe that they are equal in gods mind. Please correct me if im wrong, this is just how i interpreted your essay.
You say that women and men should have seperate roles. You didnt say what those roles are. What type of roles were you reffering to? Were they career related roles? Please tell me that you arent saying the role is to stay at home. Please tell me that you arent saying women should have leadership roles. Women are just as equally qualified for any position as men. If a woman decides to be president, and is fairly elected, then she is equally qualified. If she decides to be a doctor, she is just as qualified as a man. If she decides to become a teacher, an engineer, a lawyer, an astronaut a construction worker, or a stay at home parent, she is just as equally qualified for the job as a man. A woman should be allowed to make her own choices for her life and career and shouldnt be forces to stay within certain roles. Just as a man should not either. If a man wants to be a stay at home dad, why can’t he? Your argument of equality bith with distinct roles reminded me automatically of “seperate but equal.” In Brown v. Board of Education, the supreme court declared that seperate can never be equal. Just as it was unfair to discriminate against blacks, it is unfair to discriminate against whites. Feminists simply want equal rights for men and women, and there is nothing biblically wrong with equality.

I hope my argument isn’t disrespectful, I respect you for your beliefs, i simply wanted to state mine.

]]> by: BP http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-200809 Sat, 01 Mar 2008 15:35:19 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-200809 Awesome article! Re: Jason November 19th, 2007 at 9:48 pm Did God initially intend human kind to get the curses? So did He initially, when He was creating human, intend what He said to Eve 'Your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you.”'? Note the word 'shall'. That means it wasn't like that before! What was before, then? Before was no sin and perfection. I truely agree that we shouldn't just take anything in from any philosophers, but this I take in that the Bible is true and living. Reading the Bible (logos or the text itself) we see the applications but by the Holy Spirit, we are given the Rima - the timeless principles. Translating the Bible we should look at the whole context. Esp, if it's a letter, we should consider, who is it from? who is it to? what's the writter's intention? what's the culture? ...etc. At that time, women were dominating men. This relates very much to the greatest god of that time, 'Diana' or Dianne' who's a goddess. Yes, biblically men are to lead the family, but in this extreme case of women leading, an extreme solution/application was needed. It was their cultures since before that women must wear head coverings. In fact, only prostitudes don't. When the church was started and the teaching of being free from the law and saving by grace not by work was taken (there's nothing wrong with that in itself) but it was stumbling non/weak believers. I could just imagine the purely-women-dominated church at that time. Paul needed to do/say something for this to change! If women were given a chance to speak at church then, they would have argue and not accept even a bit of having to submit at all. Yes, wives are to submit to their husbands, but hey, husbands are to love their wives and be ready to die for them, let alone not oppressing them! Talking about equality here... This sounds like a happy and biblical family to me, if both do their roles and not keep emphasising what the other has to do. -_-" Awesome article!

Re: Jason November 19th, 2007 at 9:48 pm

Did God initially intend human kind to get the curses? So did He initially, when He was creating human, intend what He said to Eve ‘Your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you.”’? Note the word ’shall’. That means it wasn’t like that before! What was before, then? Before was no sin and perfection.

I truely agree that we shouldn’t just take anything in from any philosophers, but this I take in that the Bible is true and living. Reading the Bible (logos or the text itself) we see the applications but by the Holy Spirit, we are given the Rima - the timeless principles. Translating the Bible we should look at the whole context. Esp, if it’s a letter, we should consider, who is it from? who is it to? what’s the writter’s intention? what’s the culture? …etc.

At that time, women were dominating men. This relates very much to the greatest god of that time, ‘Diana’ or Dianne’ who’s a goddess. Yes, biblically men are to lead the family, but in this extreme case of women leading, an extreme solution/application was needed. It was their cultures since before that women must wear head coverings. In fact, only prostitudes don’t. When the church was started and the teaching of being free from the law and saving by grace not by work was taken (there’s nothing wrong with that in itself) but it was stumbling non/weak believers. I could just imagine the purely-women-dominated church at that time. Paul needed to do/say something for this to change! If women were given a chance to speak at church then, they would have argue and not accept even a bit of having to submit at all.

Yes, wives are to submit to their husbands, but hey, husbands are to love their wives and be ready to die for them, let alone not oppressing them! Talking about equality here… This sounds like a happy and biblical family to me, if both do their roles and not keep emphasising what the other has to do. -_-”

]]> by: Kenny Lewis http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-184147 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 02:55:37 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-184147 Great article! Well written! I am very proud of you. Kenny Lewis, D.D. Great article! Well written! I am very proud of you.
Kenny Lewis, D.D.

]]> by: Ruth Patternson http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-166701 Sat, 08 Dec 2007 06:53:46 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-166701 Alex & Brett, Thank you so much for this article. I agree whole heartedly with your synopsis on feminism, I would personally take it a step further and say that feminism hasn't really done us any good, Scripture has given us freedom and spiritual equality in our role as women. As a woman, I can honestly say that I have to battle my 'internal feminism' daily, but by God's grace I am learning to love and embrace the calling God has for me. My father, mother, six brothers and one sister are such an incredible encouragement to perservere. May God continue to call girls back to a biblical view of their role, that we may glorify Him in it. God Bless. Alex & Brett,
Thank you so much for this article. I agree whole heartedly with your synopsis on feminism, I would personally take it a step further and say that feminism hasn’t really done us any good, Scripture has given us freedom and spiritual equality in our role as women. As a woman, I can honestly say that I have to battle my ‘internal feminism’ daily, but by God’s grace I am learning to love and embrace the calling God has for me. My father, mother, six brothers and one sister are such an incredible encouragement to perservere. May God continue to call girls back to a biblical view of their role, that we may glorify Him in it.
God Bless.

]]> by: Jon http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-159503 Tue, 27 Nov 2007 00:51:16 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-159503 a a

]]> by: Jason http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-155003 Tue, 20 Nov 2007 04:48:35 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-155003 Before you all go off formulating your theories maybe you should try reading the rest of the Bible, and even then, read it again. I would encourage you all to not try to make your own doctrine out of what you want the Bible to say. Before you make up your mind (which may already be too late) you should consider the rest of the Bible, and not some theory written by some philosopher. Try considering 1 Corinthians 11:3 which says, "But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God." Then read the rest of the chapter (you know what, you should probably try reading the entire book in one sitting) about the covering the women is to have on her head, and how a man is to have no covering on his head. Then you should read 1 Timothy 2, specifically 11-15, which states, "11Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. 12But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 13For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. 15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety." Are women equal to their husband's or are they under them? Next you can read 1 Peter. Here is a bit from 1 Peter 3:6-7, it states, "6Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement. 7Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered." Why would Sarah call him Lord if she was his equal? This list could go on into eternity, but without the Holy Spirit living inside of you, explaining this to you, you may never understand. But that is another teaching. I would encourage you to keep searching the scriptures and pursing the things of the kingdom; but don't try to make God line up with your doctrine. Before you all go off formulating your theories maybe you should try reading the rest of the Bible, and even then, read it again. I would encourage you all to not try to make your own doctrine out of what you want the Bible to say. Before you make up your mind (which may already be too late) you should consider the rest of the Bible, and not some theory written by some philosopher.

Try considering 1 Corinthians 11:3 which says, “But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.” Then read the rest of the chapter (you know what, you should probably try reading the entire book in one sitting) about the covering the women is to have on her head, and how a man is to have no covering on his head.

Then you should read 1 Timothy 2, specifically 11-15, which states, “11Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. 12But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 13For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 14And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. 15Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.” Are women equal to their husband’s or are they under them?

Next you can read 1 Peter. Here is a bit from 1 Peter 3:6-7, it states, “6Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement. 7Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.” Why would Sarah call him Lord if she was his equal?

This list could go on into eternity, but without the Holy Spirit living inside of you, explaining this to you, you may never understand. But that is another teaching. I would encourage you to keep searching the scriptures and pursing the things of the kingdom; but don’t try to make God line up with your doctrine.

]]> by: brianne http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-136896 Sat, 13 Oct 2007 21:21:43 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-136896 Great article. Thought I'd respond to this one since I have been thinking/pondering/contemplating the subject a lot lately in order to come up with my own personal view on the subject. I read the all of the responses on the "Teens define a real woman" blog, and I have decided that my view on fe/male roles to be the biblical approach found in this article. Again, great article. Great article.
Thought I’d respond to this one since I have been thinking/pondering/contemplating the subject a lot lately in order to come up with my own personal view on the subject. I read the all of the responses on the “Teens define a real woman” blog, and I have decided that my view on fe/male roles to be the biblical approach found in this article. Again, great article.

]]> by: Bess http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-135280 Mon, 08 Oct 2007 16:12:07 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-135280 Hey Alex & Brett- I really appreciate this article. It is obviously well thought out and put forth in a simple, clear and understandable way. It is a beautiful thing when men and women work alongside each other with joy, each working in the roles they were created for. Once you can learn to live in the natural gifting of your gender, you can really flourish in all areas of your life, bringing glory to God and blessing those around you. Thanks! ~Bess B. Hey Alex & Brett-

I really appreciate this article. It is obviously well thought out and put forth in a simple, clear and understandable way. It is a beautiful thing when men and women work alongside each other with joy, each working in the roles they were created for. Once you can learn to live in the natural gifting of your gender, you can really flourish in all areas of your life, bringing glory to God and blessing those around you.

Thanks!
~Bess B.

]]> by: Kirsten Gruber http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-135065 Sun, 07 Oct 2007 22:53:08 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-135065 It's very interesting that I stumbled across this at the time I did. I literally JUST came downstairs after reading a section of the Bible in 1 Peter 3. In that sectioin, Peter was telling a church in Asia Minor about how wives are to submit to their husbands IN THE WAY THAT (if I could use italics for that phrase, I would) husbands, in response to the submitting, are to treat their wives with understanding, honor, and respect. After searching and searching, I have ALSO come to the conclusion that although their value is equal(why else would Jesus die for men AND women if it were any different?), men and women are to play different roles in the household. I feel like I'm forgetting something, but I can't seem to remeber what it is. Well, if I am forgetting something, someone can feel free to complete my thought pattern if they wish. This was a wonderful post, and thank you very much for posting it. In His Service, ~Kirsten A. Gruber It’s very interesting that I stumbled across this at the time I did. I literally JUST came downstairs after reading a section of the Bible in 1 Peter 3. In that sectioin, Peter was telling a church in Asia Minor about how wives are to submit to their husbands IN THE WAY THAT (if I could use italics for that phrase, I would) husbands, in response to the submitting, are to treat their wives with understanding, honor, and respect. After searching and searching, I have ALSO come to the conclusion that although their value is equal(why else would Jesus die for men AND women if it were any different?), men and women are to play different roles in the household.

I feel like I’m forgetting something, but I can’t seem to remeber what it is. Well, if I am forgetting something, someone can feel free to complete my thought pattern if they wish. This was a wonderful post, and thank you very much for posting it.

In His Service,
~Kirsten A. Gruber

]]> by: Bobb Banar http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-126462 Sat, 15 Sep 2007 07:11:57 +0000 http://www.therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/#comment-126462 Very good. However, I don't think you've mentioned that in some instances feminism contradicts Biblical teachings. You never mentioned that the man is supposed to be the leader of the house, loving his wife as Christ loves the church. I have always struggled with that verse, thinking it elevated men to a higher standing than women, but it is true that Christ died for the church and God is essentially commanding the male to go to those extremes for his family. The Bible does say though, that men are supposed to be the head of the household and whenever that happens, the result is generally better than when the husband and wife try to be head. I know my mother holds that belief. Many broken marriages could have been prevented by a loving husband being able to take the burden off of the wife's shoulders and the wife respecting the husband's decision and allowing him to take the responsibilities of the decisions. You might call me a male chauvanist but look in the Bible. God Bless and great overall post. Very good. However, I don’t think you’ve mentioned that in some instances feminism contradicts Biblical teachings. You never mentioned that the man is supposed to be the leader of the house, loving his wife as Christ loves the church. I have always struggled with that verse, thinking it elevated men to a higher standing than women, but it is true that Christ died for the church and God is essentially commanding the male to go to those extremes for his family. The Bible does say though, that men are supposed to be the head of the household and whenever that happens, the result is generally better than when the husband and wife try to be head. I know my mother holds that belief. Many broken marriages could have been prevented by a loving husband being able to take the burden off of the wife’s shoulders and the wife respecting the husband’s decision and allowing him to take the responsibilities of the decisions. You might call me a male chauvanist but look in the Bible. God Bless and great overall post.

]]>